Have the Souvenir books shipped to Supporting Members? I've not received mine yet, and an email to info-at-fiddlersgreen-dot-org went unanswered. (And the entire Fiddler's Green website is down today, so I'm posting my question on the board, since someone must know the shipping status.)

I...

Hrm.

I don't know the answer to that, actually. As soon as I find out, though... I'll (or someone else FG-related) will post it here.

Sorry 'bout that!

...and the website is up, and it's fiddlersgreenCON.org... which I'm assuming is what you tried, but just thought I'd check anyway.

Thanks for looking into this for me.

You're right about the typo in my post above.
The email I'd sent inquiring about this was really sent (correctly, I think) to info@fiddlersgreencon.org on Dec. 1. (And I know my credit card was charged a month ago.)

That's my bad. I'm freelance, and still catching up on all the client work that was deferred in the last couple of months of FG prep, so the souvenir books to supporting members and the attending members who didn't make it to the con haven't been mailed yet. Nor have all the thankyou notes I want to send to so many people. Gaaaah. Continuing apologies.

It seems sort of sad that all those people that spent $50 to get supporting memberships still have nothing to show even a month after the convention.

I'm sure that there are a lot of people anxiously awaiting the books.

Maybe some nice little bonus should be thrown in as an apology for people having to wait so long.

Just a thought.

Speaking as someone who bought two supporting memberships to support the CBLDF, I'd rather not cut into the proceeds for the cbldf just to get apology prizes. Most things people order take 4-8 weeks for delivery, so this is hardly out of line, especially for a convention handcrafted by such a small group of overloaded people.

I agree about not cutting into the profits, but if someone bought a supporting membership...say for a gift...it would be nice to actually have the program.

The books could have been sent out ages ago by Media Mail and people would have had them. If the person in charge of mailing them out is too busy to make a trip to the post office maybe someone else should be in charge.

I would even be willing to ship them all out personally if I thought it would help people get their books quicker.

The books might be in a place where only one committee person lives. The convention was put together by people on three continents after all, not by a group that met in person. But, that is just my speculation.

I totally understand that, but still some people may have wanted the books as a gift.

If the person in charge of mailing all the books out just doesn't have time to actually mail them out, the people who paid for a supporting membership could be waiting months and months to get their book.

With the holidays it's understandable that people are busy, but really, the books could have been sent out shortly after Fiddler's Green when the organizers were still thinking about the convention. At this point, a month after the convention, how is anybody to know that the organizers care about the supporting members and their contribution?

Hello.

You can know that the organizers care about the supporting members' contributions because I say so.

You'll note that on our website, we say that materials will be mailed out after the convention. You will also note that we did not say "immediately" after the convention. Directly after Fiddler's Green, we had a *lot* of paperwork to go through and things to set up, loose ends to tie and records to file. We're still not done.

You might want to take into consideration the fact that none of us were paid in any way to organize Fiddler's Green. In fact, many of us spent a lot of our own money in order to get it up and running, without promise of compensation (other than having a magnificent time and having the pride associated with doing something like this -- but I meant "financial compensation"). In addition to having a very full time job on Fiddler's Green, I had a very very full time job in order to pay my own personal bills. As did/do all of us who volunteered for committee. What this means is that sometimes we need to attend to matters in our lives that are not connected to Fiddler's Green.

I know for a fact that a handful of us juggled responsibilities in our day to day lives in order to get FG done on time -- and are now behind on the work we have to do for our real, pays-the-bills jobs.

It's not that we don't care, it's that we cared so much about doing FG right that we're a little tied up now, even a month after FG. Please exercise your patience -- we won't forget about sending out the materials we've promised that you've purchased.

Maure

I completely understand that people have lives outside of Fiddler's Green and as I mentioned before the holidays create more stress and more work than usual and people are busy. GMZoe mentioned that a normal business would take 4-8 weeks for delivery of items purchased. Does that mean that we will get the books within the next 3 weeks? It is true that the website never gave a specific time frame and so I guess it's possible that we could be waiting a month or two or maybe even longer. If there's no obligation on the time these books are sent, it could be 6 months or a year before someone finds the time to send them out. We just don't know. Even though Fiddler's Green was run by volunteers, it is still a business. If this was an ebay transaction I think all of us would have emailed the seller several times by now asking where our items were and possibly even have left negative feedback assuming that the seller was not going to send the items won.

Having said that and saying it again, I understand that people are busy, but consider this: Over the last few weeks I've converted 13 videos of the 13 Nights Of Fright to dvd (each taking about 2.5 hours to convert), burned 115 dvds for several people (each taking about an hour to burn and cost me about $75 in dvds) for people who I've never met. I've designed artwork for the dvds and had to buy a new printer because mine broke in the process due to stress and am currently waiting for the cases I special ordered to arrive (which are about a week late). I've done this while working a 50 hour week job and remodelling my house. It's all been with my own money with no compensation expected from any of the people I am sending these to. My goal was to have them to everyone by Christmas and if the cases would have been here they would have been. Even with all the other personal things I have going on in my life, I still found the time to try to get these in people's hands before Christmas.

After doing so much work, on the dvds along with my normal life it is hard for me to understand how someone couldn't take some books to the post office. As I mentioned before, if the person in charge of shipping the books needs help mailing them send them to me and it will be done immediately.

Maybe people are unreasonable about wanting their books or maybe it's only the people who don't have the books yet, that haven't seen them yet, who are still excited about the books.

I know that there is a lot of work that still needs to be done with shipping the books and I'm hoping that after the holidays someone will make it a priority to get them out to all of the supporting members, but I'd be concerned that after the holidays people will go back to their normal lives and jobs and school and still be too busy to send stuff out, especially if they haven't done it at this point.

I'm sorry if this seems really negative, it's not intended to be. It's just that there are still some people who are very anxious to see a glimpse of the hard work everyone put into the convention.

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Originally posted by quiddity:
I completely understand that people have lives outside of Fiddler's Green and as I mentioned before the holidays create more stress and more work than usual and people are busy. GMZoe mentioned that a normal business would take 4-8 weeks for delivery of items purchased. Does that mean that we will get the books within the next 3 weeks?

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No, it doesn't... since Fiddler's Green isn't a "normal business". He also mentions, if you didn't see, that this delay is "...hardly out of line, especially for a convention handcrafted by such a small group of overloaded people."

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It is true that the website never gave a specific time frame and so I guess it's possible that we could be waiting a month or two or maybe even longer. If there's no obligation on the time these books are sent, it could be 6 months or a year before someone finds the time to send them out. We just don't know.

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No, you don't. Also, it seems you don't know much about supporting memberships and the subsequent mailouts at conventions. On the average, it *does* take a month or more for the materials to collected, organized, processed, shipped, etc.

The books will go out. Don't worry about that. Have a little patience and support for those of us who worked our asses off to make the convention, and therefore the books, more than a remote possibility.

As Davey said, *contributors* and people who worked *directly on FG* haven't been mailed their copies yet, either. She apologized. Take that into consideration.

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Even though Fiddler's Green was run by volunteers, it is still a business. If this was an ebay transaction I think all of us would have emailed the seller several times by now asking where our items were and possibly even have left negative feedback assuming that the seller was not going to send the items won.

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But, it's not an eBay transaction, is it? It's something altogether different and original.

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Having said that and saying it again, I understand that people are busy, but consider this:

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(snip)

Good for you. I'm glad that you are so selflessly copying (pirating?) movies for people. You, however, didn't run a convention as well, and are therefore responsible for that *on top* of everything else you mentioned... which the average person working/running FG experienced.

...not to mention the non-average pregnancies, hospital visits, job-losses, and breakdowns.

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After doing so much work, on the dvds along with my normal life it is hard for me to understand how someone couldn't take some books to the post office.

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If only it was that easy.

There's obviously more going on than just some random person sitting at home with 200 copies of a friggin' book on their couch.

Please understand this, accept the apologies, and have patience.

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Maybe people are unreasonable about wanting their books or maybe it's only the people who don't have the books yet, that haven't seen them yet, who are still excited about the books.

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Perhaps those people should, again, have a little patience, and trust that the people responsible for FG... who sacrificed everything from money, time, and personal well-being to pull the convention off ... won't steer them wrong, and will get their books to them as soon as it is possible.

Maybe a little faith and good-natured holiday spirit and well-wishes would be better than bitching and complaining... but hey, that's just me.

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I know that there is a lot of work that still needs to be done with shipping the books

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Well, if you knew that... then why all the crap? Just sit back, enjoy the holidays, have a little eggnog, and be nice.

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...and I'm hoping that after the holidays someone will make it a priority to get them out to all of the supporting members, but I'd be concerned that after the holidays people will go back to their normal lives and jobs and school and still be too busy to send stuff out, especially if they haven't done it at this point.

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Ok... last time.

Your book will be sent out. Don't worry.

It's just taking a little longer than you thought.

It will be there.

Honest.

I'm serious.

Your book will be there.

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I'm sorry if this seems really negative, it's not intended to be.

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Well, it was.

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It's just that there are still some people who are very anxious to see a glimpse of the hard work everyone put into the convention.

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Well, trust me in saying that some of the people that did all that hard work are *still* recovering from the physical, emotional, and financial drain that FG caused.

We weren't paid for it.

We didn't get our flights paid and our meals bought.

Christ... we even paid to attend our own convention.

We did this out of sheer Because We Said So, and did it because it was a Good Idea for a Good Cause.

So, if you're just some anxious person waiting for a glimpse of the hard work... again, have some patience. Don't go knocking down that hard work by being grumpy and asking for bonus stuff.

Be patient, chill out, and enjoy the holidays with your loved ones.

Now if you'll excuse me, I have a house, as well, that I need to finish remodeling... then clean... then decorate... in time for Friday... check that, THURSDAY... because my uncle is coming into town.

Yay.

I appreciate you taking the time to reassure everyone that they will get their books.

I think we all understand that the convetion was very crazy and chaotic for everyone organizing them and we will just have to be patient for all the books.

Of course, I've offered to help twice..to alleviate some of the stress...offered to help mail things out to people so they could get things quicker...and it seems that help isn't wanted or is ignored, which is fine. I guess i'm just confused why it is that if at least one person is offering to help get books out quicker why it isn't happening.

I don't think anything more can really be said because the books are going to be sent out whenever time can be found....whenever it becomes a priority.

Again I'm sorry if this seems negative because really it's not intended to be despite whatever you may think.

no offense, but i'm going to assume that the con leaders don't know you from adam. and if they don't know you, then why should they send you the books? you're pirating 13 nights of fright for friends, how do they know some or all of the con books won't mysteriously disappear, or pop up on ebay? hmm? did you consider that? why don't you let the con leaders handle things. if they need help, they'll talk amongst themselves.

and also if YOU've ordered some souvenir books for xmas presesnts, why don't you say so directly, and ask if things can be sped up with YOUR order, instead of alluding to some people? if you have a special case, explain it rather than rant your disatisfaction with the whole process...

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Originally posted by quiddity:
I appreciate you taking the time to reassure everyone that they will get their books.

I think we all understand that the convetion was very crazy and chaotic for everyone organizing them and we will just have to be patient for all the books.

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Yup. Patient, and not negative or bitchy about it.

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Of course, I've offered to help twice..to alleviate some of the stress...offered to help mail things out to people so they could get things quicker...and it seems that help isn't wanted or is ignored, which is fine.

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And you say your words aren't intended to be negative?

"Help isn't wanted or is ignored."

Right. Not negative. That's happy and upbeat, it is.

We appreciate the offer for the help... however, to simply ship you X-number of books, to have you then ship them is neither:

A) Cost effective
B) Safe

No offense, but We Don't Know You. Just sending a random person a crapload of books to send out isn't exactly sane now, is it? We wouldn't know if some "got lost" or ended up on eBay, or whatnot.

The graciousness is appreciated. However, it's just not safe for the product, nor cost effective to do so.

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I guess i'm just confused why it is that if at least one person is offering to help get books out quicker why it isn't happening.

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Because it's not. Now, last time...

Be Patient.

You've been more than patient, yes, I know. Now it's time to be Very Patient and Gracious that we even *offered* Supporting Memberships (I, personally, was against the idea).

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I don't think anything more can really be said because the books are going to be sent out whenever time can be found....whenever it becomes a priority.

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Again... this isn't supposed to be negative?

"Whenever it becomes a priority."

You know what that says to us? It says "Obviously, you FG people don't have the courtesy to people who spent money, but didn't go to the convention."

It says "You guys aren't doing good enough, so have the grace to accept some help".

That, my friend, is negative.

<sighs>

Of course it is a priority.

Supporting/Contributing mailouts ARE the priority.

If you *honestly* think we are just sitting on our asses and doing nothing about it, I suggest you *seriously* reconsider that.

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Again I'm sorry if this seems negative because really it's not intended to be despite whatever you may think.

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Context points otherwise.

Have a happy holiday, and don't worry about the damn book. It'll get there.

Heh. You think this convention lot's behind. The 22nd International Conference of Malacologists still hasn't published its proceedings. From 1998.

Well, first of all, the dvds I'm making aren't for friends because I don't know the people I'm making them for. Also, I seem to have seen Walker on that list of people I'm supposed to be making them for. Third, they aren't really pirated because they aren't available for sale. If they were, I wouldn't be or have to make copies for anyone and the quality would be a whole lot better than something recorded off tv.

About the books, I understand the point that the whole committee doesn't know who I am. I'm fine with that because I'm just a lurker over on a.f.n.g, and really, only one (potentially two) of the other volunteers know who I am...so I can totally understand that. Perhaps some of the other volunteer..someone that Davey or Sheila knows could help after the holiday rush is over.

I'm just trying to think of ideas to help remove some of the stress from one person having to do all the work AND help the supporting members get the books and be very happy with the whole thing. I realize that people volunteered and that very few people were paid or any sort of "credit" and packaging up a bunch of books is not a pleasant thing to do, so I can understand why someone would want to put off such a tedious task.

I know that the books will come eventually and I'm hoping sooner rather than later, but trying to come up with a way for everyone to get their books faster is a battle that I can't win because there's nothing I can personally do to help (even though I would like to) and trying to come up with quicker solutions isn't getting anywhere.

I hope that everyone has a fantastic holiday and maybe we'll all the supporting members will get a nice new years package from the Fiddler's Green committee.

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Originally posted by quiddity:
Well, first of all, the dvds I'm making aren't for friends because I don't know the people I'm making them for. Also, I seem to have seen Walker on that list of people I'm supposed to be making them for.

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No idea why... I DVR'd 'em. I don't need 'em.

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About the books, I understand the point that the whole committee doesn't know who I am. I'm fine with that because I'm just a lurker over on a.f.n.g, and really, only one (potentially two) of the other volunteers know who I am...so I can totally understand that. Perhaps some of the other volunteer..someone that Davey or Sheila knows could help after the holiday rush is over.

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Rob... check this out...

There's no need to name drop.

There's no need to keep explaining.

We get it.

What you need to do is be patient and let it go, man.

You'll get them. Honest. Really. I mean, for sure, man.

Now, stop. When there's an update... Maure, Davey, Myself... someone FG-related will post it.

Until then... your opinion has been noted.

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I realize that people volunteered and that very few people were paid

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Paid?!

People were paid?!

Pffft.

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...or any sort of "credit" and packaging up a bunch of books is not a pleasant thing to do, so I can understand why someone would want to put off such a tedious task.

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$%#^$#%!

That's it. Ok look... now I'm pissed off.

Listen: You keep saying it's not negative, etc. That's absolute garbage. Saying you can understand someone "putting off a tedious task" and all that just drives the point home that yes, you're unhappy, and yes, this is all negative, and yes... it's taking a while.

I'm here to tell you... One Last Time... that it's NOT a slight to the Supporting Memberships... it's NOT a mis-management of priorities... it's NOT someone sitting on their ass as you so eloquently state...

Shit got in the way. Ok?

We're sorry it's taken this long. We appreciate the patience. Now, be a little more patient, and all will be fine.

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I know that the books will come eventually and I'm hoping sooner rather than later, but trying to come up with a way for everyone to get their books faster is a battle that I can't win because there's nothing I can personally do to help (even though I would like to) and trying to come up with quicker solutions isn't getting anywhere.

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ARGH!

Fine. Fuck this.

I'll send you MY goddamn copy, just to stop this whine-fest. I can wait for a replacement. I'm perfectly happy with a replacement. I can wait as long as I have to.

Why? Because I trust the person(s) mailing them out.

Email me your address. Send it to nightwalker at neilgaiman dot com. I'll send the fucking thing out tomorrow.

How's that for a solution?

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I hope that everyone has a fantastic holiday and maybe we'll all the supporting members will get a nice new years package from the Fiddler's Green committee.

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Yeah. Really happy Tuesday to you too.

Wow...someone is a bit pissy. Sorry that I brought that out in you. I really didn't want to.

Thanks for letting me know that I don't need me to send you a copy of the dvds. Your name was on my list...not sure why, I assumed that you signed up. As I said, I don't know the people I am making them for. I just offered because I recorded them and know that not everyone was able to see them.

Also, just for the record, I'm not name dropping. As far as Davey and Sheila goes...I know who they are and their involvement in the convention and program because of these dvds I'm making. Really, I was just trying to help and I can understand the reasons for not wanting extra help since you and a majority of the committee have no clue who I am. I understand that and honestly didn't really think about that because I was just trying to help.

As far as you taking my comment about packing the books as being negative, all I can say is sorry. It wasn't meant to be. I do tons of mailing and I know how tedious it can be. Again, I was just trying to help.

I'm a bit hurt and I'm know that it's my fault because of my word choices or whatever, but my intentions were good and I can understand how people are anxious to get their programs and all and as I said, I wanted to help and made the offer and that's all I can do.

Thanks for your offer to send your program, but I think that if anyone should get their programs first it should be someone like loukoumi who asked first.

Anyway, I hope that you have a good holiday.