For those of you that may want this, but don't want to typ it out... just cut and paste the following... this quote'll go on my web page most likely...


“I can believe that things are true and I can believe things that aren’t true and I can believe things where nobody knows if they’re true or not. I can believe in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny and Marilyn Monroe and the Beatles and Elvis and Mister Ed. Listen – I believe that people are perfectible, that knowledge is infinite, that the world is run by secret banking cartels and is visited by aliens on a regular basis, nice ones that look like wrinkledy lemurs and bad ones who mutilate cattle and want our water and our women. I believe that the future sucks and I believe that future rocks and I believe that one day White Buffalo Woman is going to come back and kick everyone’s ass. I believe that all men are just overgrown boys with deep problems communicating and that the decline in good sex in America is coincident with the decline in drive-in movie theaters from state to state. I believe that all politicians are unprincipled crooks and I still believe that they are better than the alternative. I believe that California is going to sink into the sea when the big one comes, while Florida is going to dissolve into madness and alligators and toxic waste. I believe that antibacterial soap is destroying our resistance to dirt and disease so that one day we’ll all be wiped out by the common cold like the Martians in War of the Worlds. I believe that the greatest poets of the last century were Edith Sitwell and Don Marquis, that jade is dried dragon sperm, and that thousands of years ago in a former life I was a one-armed Siberian shaman. I believe that mankind’s destiny lies in the stars. I believe that candy really did taste better when I was a kid, that it’s aerodynamically impossible for a bumblebee to fly, that light is a wave and a particle, that there’s a cat in a box somewhere who’s alive and dead at the same time (although if they don’t ever open the box to feed it it’ll eventually just be two different kinds of dead), and that there are stars in the universe billions of years older than the universe itself. I believe in a personal god who cares about me and worries and oversees everything I do. I believe in an impersonal god who set the universe in motion and went off to hang with her girlfriends and doesn’t even know that I’m alive. I believe in an empty and godless universe of casual chaos, background noise, and sheer blind luck. I believe that anyone who says that sex is overrated just hasn’t done it properly. I believe that anyone claims to know what’s going on will lie about the little things too. I believe in absolute honesty and sensible social lies. I believe in a woman’s right to choose, a baby’s right to live, that while all human life is sacred there’s nothing wrong with the death penalty if you can trust the legal system implicitly, and that no one but a moron would ever trust the legal system. I believe life is a game, that life is a cruel joke, and that life is what happens when you’re alive and that you might as well lie back and enjoy it.”

Samantha Black Crow’s speech in “American Gods” by Neil Gaiman

Offtopic
www.severetiredamage.net


[This message has been edited by Offtopic (edited 07-06-2001).]

Ya know, that might make a fabulous Audition monologue...

--Ember--

Wasn't there something like that in "Bull Durham"? beautiful speech (neil's i mean)

I really Really do love that speech. Maybe I should memorize it, and drive all my non-Neil-fan friends mad with it.

Angelina.

quote:

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Originally posted by The Lord of Nothings:
Wasn't there something like that in "Bull Durham"?

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Two of 'em... one by Crash (Kevin Costner) and one by Annie (Susan Sarandon). The Kevin Costner one follows.... (Warning: May contain objectionable language)...


"Well, I believe in the soul, the cock, the pussy, the small of a woman's back, the hanging curve ball, high fiber, good scotch, that the novels of Susan Sontag are self-indulgent, overrated crap. I believe Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone. I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. I believe in the sweet spot, soft-core pornography, opening your presents Christmas morning rather than Christmas Eve and I believe in long, slow, deep, soft, wet kisses that last three days. [pause] Goodnight."


-=- Saint NightWalker -=-
Platinum Services only
available to Platinum Members

quote:

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Originally posted by Offtopic:
For those of you that may want this, but don't want to typ it out... just cut and paste the following... this quote'll go on my web page most likely...

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Hmmmm I'm not really sure you should post stuff like that here. Its a very long quote - it's really more like an excerpt from the novel. Of course it was going to appear on the WWW sooner or later, but the official Neil Gaiman page is probably not the right place to post copyrighted material from Gaimans work without Gaiman's permission.

Oh well, it probably doesn't matter. Like I said, its the kind of material that's bound to turn up on the web somewhere. . .

Michael

I take your point, but I'm sure Neil wouldn't mind.

Hell, I was going to type it up and print it out anyway, to put on my wall.

Might get it onto a t-shirt too...

I think I saw a few typos and some missing commas in the text. (Haven't got the book here, so I can't compare) If people start mailing the text to their friends, it should be the text that Gaiman originally intendeed. Couldn't you fix it?

Hey, mtxx. Do you know how ridiculous you sound? You really think that Gaiman would be bothered by someone putting a couple of paragraphs from his book on the message boards that are dedicated to said book? I just don't have the words to describe how stupid that is...

No need to be mean - mtxx has a good point, though. Even if it can be freely posted here (being a Neil Gaimam forum), should it be copied and pasted elsewhere without the man's permission?

I don't know him, personally, but from what others have said, I doubt he would care. Especially if credit is given where due - if you do paste this on websites or in e-mails or on T-shirts, better make sure you mark where it is from and by whom it was written! Not that I think any fan here would try to steal Neil's work.

Jaer

I think it's funny how you all refer to him as "Neil", like you know him or something. It's kind of sad and a little creepy.

And if it were a copyright issue, I'm pretty sure that you would have to get permission from the publisher. Not the author. That's what it sys at the front of the book, anyway.

I think the author owns the copyright, though. It can even be passed on through the family in wills and stuff - Tolkien's son owns Tolkien's copyrights, I believe, so he is the only one who can legally write and publish new stories about middle-earth.

As for calling Neil Neil - it's a lot easier then writing Mr. Gaiman everytime, or even Gaiman. And it looks stupid to call him NG (which immediately made me think of Nuetral Good - any one else or am I alone on this) not to mention that it seems less respectful.

Jaer

For me, NG= Newgrounds. As in Newgrounds.com, home of sick Flash stuff. The first-name basis thing is weird, but its something fans do. Witness "Tori," "John" (of the Beatles)... stuff like that. It disturbs me a bit, but I still do it.

The (someday people will do that to me) Floyd

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Originally posted by Stargrave:
I think it's funny how you all refer to him as "Neil",

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Why? It's his name. I'm Walker. He's Neil.... where is the problem?

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like you know him or something.

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I... umm... do. Had dinner with him. Knows me by sight. Drops me emails. Uses my pen when he's out of ink in his. I'm on the christmas/hannukah list.

Is there a problem?

quote:

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It's kind of sad and a little creepy.

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No, it's not. People introduce themselves to him at signings "Hi, my name is _____ " and he responds "Hi. I'm Neil. Shall I scribble in your book?"

He's very personable. He gets to know people.

What I find disturbing, however, is that you have a problem with it.

I seriously doubt you refer to every person that isn't a close aquaintance as 'Mr.' or 'Ms.'. I doubt you say 'Mr. Presley' when talking about Elvis or 'Ms. Amos' when talking about Tori.

Personally, I find saying 'Gaiman' or 'King' or 'Barker' or 'Stephenson' is totally impersonal and cold. These are people. They breathe, they eat, they shit, and they sleep. They're just like you and me. That's all. Sure, they have some sort of celebrity attatched to them... big deal... that doesn't automatically make them immune to being friends and such.

How about this... why don't you, when you next see him... ask him what he would like to be called? I'm pretty sure he'll say 'Neil's fine'... or something completely off the wall, like 'You can call me Floobie Bumwater, if you like' or 'Nel. Nel Gurgle.'

Just don't knock what people say, simply because they feel more comfortable/have a reason/etc. differently from yours.

-=- Saint NightWalker -=-
Daily Value not Established

Yeah, I guess if he told me to call him "Neil", I would. But he didn't tell me to, so I won't. You think that calling someone by a last name is cold? I don't think that many people would know who I was talking about if I walked around saying things like "Oh Neil is such a wonderful author! I love him soooo much!" They would look at me like a freak and probably (and understandably) make fun of me. It's like dropping names. It's a weird thing to act so familliar with someone you don't even know. It's just a pet peeve of mine I guess.
And by the way, "SaintNightWalker", I'm sure that you have a very beautiful relationship with "Neil". I didn't mean to hurt your feelings, buddy. You should still feel free to drop his name whenever you get the chance, as I'm sure you do.

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Originally posted by Stargrave:
Yeah, I guess if he told me to call him "Neil", I would. But he didn't tell me to, so I won't.

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Did you ever ask?

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You think that calling someone by a last name is cold?

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...and impersonal. Also... how would you approach someone like Brom, or Cher, or Sisqo, or Prince, or Teller? Kinda hard, huh?

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I don't think that many people would know who I was talking about if I walked around saying things like "Oh Neil is such a wonderful author! I love him soooo much!" They would look at me like a freak and probably (and understandably) make fun of me.

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Ok, this might seem a little weird... but you're on the message boards at neilgaiman.com. I'm not sure you know this, but you are.

So, umm... I'm fairly certain people will know who you're talking about when you say 'Neil' around here, of if they don't, I'm even more certain that they could gleam the meaning of it from the surrounding content.

I know it's hard to observe some things, but hey... I know you try.

quote:

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It's like dropping names. It's a weird thing to act so familliar with someone you don't even know. It's just a pet peeve of mine I guess.

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I can see where this is going... let me guess, it's not easy being green?

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And by the way, "SaintNightWalker"

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That's Saint NightWalker... no quotes. It's a title and a name... not a nomenclature, "Stargrave". Only reason it runs together, is that they didn't allow spaces in the screen name field.

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I'm sure that you have a very beautiful relationship with "Neil".

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That's Neil... again, it's his name. No quotes... and we're friends. It's not like we're roommates and drinking buddies. Sheesh. Get over yourself already.

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I didn't mean to hurt your feelings, buddy.

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You didn't, don't worry about it, and you're far from my 'buddy'. It's your own self-esteem that I'm worried about. You seem to have this hangup about average people being friend with people you admire... well, sorry man... it happens. They're just people too.

quote:

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You should still feel free to drop his name whenever you get the chance, as I'm sure you do.

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Ahh... assuming I do name-dropping. Funny how that happens. Well, guess what kiddo... I don't. I actually keep it pretty freakin' quiet... and not a lot of people know, unless it's been pointed out in other forms... like being pointed out in a crowd at Con, or people coming up saying 'Hey, I recognize you from your pictures at website'...

When ever I talk about my friends, I just talk about them. I don't care if they're famous, or not, or whatever. I don't name-drop... I talk about my friends.

Oh, and by the way... knowing people doesn't get you into lines for free, or anything like that. I still stand in line just like everybody else, get my stuff signed with the same squiggle as everybody else, and get my questions overlooked during Q'n'A's just like everybody else.

Imagine that.

Now, take your little bitchfest into a corner, and whimper. Jealousy doesn't fit you, and there's really nothing to be jealous about.

Man... even message boards get trolls. What is this world coming to?

-=- Saint NightWalker -=-
That was fun... like kicking
a kitten through an electric fan.

[This message has been edited by SaintNightWalker (edited 07-26-2001).]

Saint, are you trying to live up to that Ass post? Personally, I think you live up to my DABOMB thread. Man, we just don't got enough to do.

Nightwalker beat me to some points I had in response to your posts. If you refer to Neil on a Neil Gaiman board, people will know who you're talking about. If we were in a public situation with people who have no idea who "Mr. Gaiman" is, then we would elaborate, probably try to convert the others into new readers. (And btw, do your friends make fun of you that easily? Just for referring to an author by first name?)
My friends all refer to him as Neil. Every single one. He's a friendly guy, and I think it's wonderful that his work is personal enough that people refer to him on a first name basis even if they've never met him.
But moreover
look at the few posts you've had here. In this thread, the only thing you've done is make fun of how everyone else acts, first with mtxx, then everyone for calling him Neil. The topic of how you refer to authors (first name or last) in common practice is a valid topic which I've discussed with my friends. If you want to debate, respect the other people you're chatting with. If you want to make a personal attack on me, as you seem to want to do with Nightwalker, then go to the "let's badmouth GMZoe" thread in the World's End forum and let the people in this thread discuss the "I Believe" speech instead of your attitude

It's kind of pathetic that you take the time to dissect the messages I take a couple of minutes to write off the top of my head.
It was a simple observation, not a "bitchfest". It was an opinon (and this board is for voicing opinions) that I threw in while staying on topic. The post after that was in response to yours. I really don't care what you think. Seeing your dumbass name, oh I'm sorry, your dumbass "title", lets me know all I need to know about you.
Stargrave is from a comic book by Grant Morrison. Oh, I'm sorry should I have just referred to him as Grant? And what exactly makes you think that I am jealous of you? I don't even fucking know you. You are just another guy sitting in front of a computer spouting whatever bullshit he wants. How much did you have to edit your little rant? Hard to get it just perfect, eh?
YOU are the one that made it sound like you and Neil Gaiman were sucking each others dicks, not me. So get over it.
I really have no desire to meet Neil Gaiman, I mean I'm sure he's a nice guy and everything, but meeting pseudo celebrities is not very high on my wish list.I would rather just read his stuff.
I THINK YOU ARE VERY FUCKING COOL, OK? You are better than me and everyone else here, you have proven your dominance, pissed all over this thread and marked it as your territory. YOU WIN, OK? So just let it go. Something tells me that you won't, though. Something tells me that you have to have the last word, no matter how warped your logic is. Prove me wrong please.

This topic seems to have already generated a certain amount of controversy, but here's my two cents:

I kinda felt that the 'I Believe' speech was a bit silly. Maybe even a bit contrived. Sam became a cliche I think. I was intrigued by her at first and wondered how she'd be defined as a character. I was waiting for her to develop and she seemed to hold so much promise as a contributor to the plot. By the time the speech was presented I'd lost my interest in her.

I can respect an open mind and a quirky philosophy but this was just too easy, too convenient. I suppose it helped her cope with what Shadow but still...

So problem then isn't so much the speech, but the character of Sam herself. I'm not sure how relevant she was and I think the speech was a way of trying to trick me into thinking she was more important than she actually was. Sam is certainly remembered , but I can't escape the impression that she really didn't need to be there and 'I Believe' was just a hurried attempt to define her.

I might get killed for this...

[This message has been edited by Guardrail Avenger (edited 07-27-2001).]