Wow. Overgeneralize much?

One is thankful to note that Mr. Gaiman doesn't usually use such sloppy logic (especially since one of his fellow authors whom he loves and respects greatly is a dedicated, forthright American Christian: Gene Wolfe). I'm willing to bet everyhing I own that your reasons aren't his.

Oh, and you missed us Eastern Orthodox Christians living here in America in your screed. I don't know whether to be amused or not by the omission.

Overgeneralization is a product of the medium. I could have written a dissertation, with all the necessary qualifiers (that the majority of Christians are like the majority of everyone--nice, sincere people) but I don't have the interest in writing a document of the requisite length on that topic. The reasons I gave are not why Neil left Jesus out, but why I am glad that he did, and why I feel any deeper broaching of the subject would have been inappropriate.

In any case, Jesus is not a god to most people, even most sincere Christians. The idea of Jesus being an energy vampire in the vein of the other gods in the story would have likely been deeply offensive to the sensibilities of most Christians, which is probably another cosideration Neil had in omitting any wider role for Jesus to play.

You are contradicting yourself. In your first post, you started with the following sentence: "I believe that Jesus was left out, all except for the passing reference, because of the nature of Christian worship in America (which mirrors the worship of the other gods, in a way)."

Now you wrote: "The reasons I gave are not why Neil left Jesus out, but why I am glad that he did, and why I feel any deeper broaching of the subject would have been inappropriate."

You can pick one or the other but not both.

And I don't require a dissertation. Simple logic and knowing what actually happened in the story is all that're necessary for this board. (For example, you wrote, "So Jesus himself would be rather a footnote in the American Gods universe, kept substantial by the ragged core of people that actually worship him, but unable even to scrape by with any supernatural abilities." But how does that square with the story showing that Easter has supernatural power, when Mr. Wednesday proves to her, and Shadow, that hardly anyone, even in San Fran, knows anything about her or her worship? Maybe it would help you to reread the book, paying attention to what is written this time and not what you wish was written, and then tackle this question again. Just a thought. Oh -- and I seriously doubt that Mr. Gaiman left Jesus out because he didn't want to deeply offend the sensibilities of most Christians. Judging by his own words re his own writings, he writes the story he wants to write. He doesn't tailor it to the desires of others, no matter how numerous an audience those "others" might be.)

Because perhaps my initial post was just that: my initial thought on the topic, written in leisure without any thought to any of the other posts (or posters) on the thread. Yes, it is a contradiction. Contradictions and logical fallacies are perfectly fine in amateur literature.

I understand that I offended you with the points I raised. I also notice that you did not dispute any of them. I was speaking from my own experience with Christianity in this country, and bringing up several different possible points which would disqualify Jesus as anything corporeal, like Easter or Wednesday or the others which were incarnate and personified.

Also, I said that the sensibilities of most Christians was likely a consideration. Last I checked, consideration does not equal root cause, unlike what you seem to be inferring. Consciously or not, Gaiman (or his editors) likely had potential controversies in the back of his (or their) mind(s) when cutting the one scene in which Jesus did actually play a major role.

And the story of Easter doesn't show that she has any kind of supernatural power...it just shows that she has accumulated a large amount of material wealth. Her confrontation with Wednesday proves, however, that she is spiritually impoverished and just barely clinging on to her menial existence by the skin of an Easter Egg. She's weak, emotionally and metaphysically, and in the end of the scene we see that her great material wealth counts for little or nothing.

What can be said is that, had Jesus been included, he would have had even less real influence than Easter had. And the most basic reason that Jesus didn't show up physically in the story proper is also the most likely one: he, as a character, simply had nothing to add to the plot that wasn't already added by someone else. Any function he fulfilled was already done, or it was cleanly omitted without damaging the storyline.

Reiterating what has already been mentioned, this story is about the America beneath the TV screen, the America that Americans aren't proud of and don't project out into the rest of the world--or even amongst themselves. The Jesus culture pervades America to such an extent that it is, largely, background noise in a story which focuses on the intricate close-ups of the bizarre and out-of-the-way little characterizations that mark America's exxentricities. As such it can be ignored, factored out of every scene, much like we automatically factor out the 1 in the algebraic phrase 1X+1X=2X, as, since it can be assumed that it is universally present, we can go about our business without even having to address it.

Had the story meandered along a different path and brought Neil to a place where Jesus's appearance was appropriate, he would have made an appearance. Though I believe that if he had, he wouldn't have been anything like you or I or anyone currently envisions Jesus at all.

quote:

And the story of Easter doesn't show that she has any kind of supernatural power...it just shows that she has accumulated a large amount of material wealth. Her confrontation with Wednesday proves, however, that she is spiritually impoverished and just barely clinging on to her menial existence by the skin of an Easter Egg. She's weak, emotionally and metaphysically, and in the end of the scene we see that her great material wealth counts for little or nothing.

--------

Oh my God.

Easter was the one who took Shadow down from the tree, and was instrumental in bringing him back to life. She has spiritual power; otherwise, why would Wednesday have warned Shadow about her, in ways he doesn't warn Shadow about some of the other gods they meet? She has great material wealth? What are you talking about? Where is that shown?

Until you know what actually happens in the book, you don't deserve for me to address your specific contentions about Christianity in America (although I did -- remember the overgeneralization comment? But wait. That's right; you think that overgeneralization and contridictory logic are okay in amateur writing. Uhm, no. Where on earth did you get those bogus "rules" of amateur writing?? Plus, I'm neither a Roman Catholic nor a protestant Christian, the sects you specifically mentioned.).

And please, don't try to speak for why Mr. Gaiman writes anything. You know nothing about that and have no ability or right to speculate like you do. What a ridiculously stupid thing to do.

And willful stupidity is the only thing that offends me. Quit being that and I'm fine.

quote:

Oh my God.

Blasphemy, my dear.

quote:

Easter was the one who took Shadow down from the tree, and was instrumental in bringing him back to life. She has spiritual power; otherwise, why would Wednesday have warned Shadow about her, in ways he doesn't warn Shadow about some of the other gods they meet? She has great material wealth? What are you talking about? Where is that shown?

She has a nice, big house. She claims to be rich in the scene where she is humbled by Wednesday, and there is a bit of evidence hinted that this is true. Now that you have me recollecting it, I am willing to concede that Easter does have some limited abilities, but her role is still ancillary, much as she is to this discussion.

quote:

Until you know what actually happens in the book, you don't deserve for me to address your specific contentions about Christianity in America (although I did -- remember the overgeneralization comment? But wait. That's right; you think that overgeneralization and contridictory logic are okay in amateur writing. Uhm, no. Where on earth did you get those bogus "rules" of amateur writing?? Plus, I'm neither a Roman Catholic nor a protestant Christian, the sects you specifically mentioned.).

I shall not belabor overly much to point out the silliness of refusing to address prescient points I bring up because other points have proven to be less so. I shall only say that 1) I never laid down any rules, only pointed out the lack of rules in this form of casual discourse, and 2) I used the terms of Christianity as a blanket for all sects, and Catholic and Protestant as more specific examples with which the vast majority of Americans are familiar and to which they adhere. Eastern Orthodox Christianity is far less common than Catholicism and the grab-bag tent of Protestantism, but it is still a sect of Christianity, and so you can feel comfortable knowing that I had your faith in mind when rendering my opinions of the religion in general.

quote:

And please, don't try to speak for why Mr. Gaiman writes anything. You know nothing about that and have no ability or right to speculate like you do. What a ridiculously stupid thing to do.

Is that not the entire point of this thread? Someone wanting to know why Neil wrote his book without including one mythical god-figure? If you believe that I, and by extension everyone else, hold no right to speculate on Neil's reasons, why the hell are you even posting here?

quote:

And willful stupidity is the only thing that offends me. Quit being that and I'm fine.

Indeed. I believe this shall be the last comment I make here, as clearly I have no right to hold an opinion on a piece of art which is circulating amongst the public.

Good day.

Jesus wouldn't be on Earth yet. Not until the endtimes at least.

My friend said this to me, and it makes the most sense, for me at least:

Jesus is worshiped for having died for our sins and all that good stuff, so people worship him as dead and in Heaven. So Jesus on Earth might contradict that.