Hi all,

This is a fairly ambitious post in an attempt to stir up some Gaiman discussion, so please bear with me by answering ANY of the following questions:

1) Did you like American Gods? Why or why not?
2) If you were to put American Gods into a genre, what would it be?
3) If you have read other works by Gaiman, why were you attracted to them?
4) How often do you read, or how much experience with English literature do you have?
5) What is your sex and (ballpark) age?

Now, the reasons for all my poking and prodding:

I have been a casual fan of Neil Gaiman's work for the past few years, but only recently have I begun to seriously look at Neil's work - American Gods in particular - in a critical light.

Why?

I'm a 4th year English undergrad, and for my literary theory seminar I chose to examine 'American Gods' as work of popular fiction, from a cultural studies perspective. If you're not sure what cultural studies is, just Wikipedia it. If you're too lazy, it's not that important anyway.

The reason I'm posting this is since there really hasn't been that much literary criticism concerning Gaiman, the Internet is my deepest resource, so this is one of the ways I'm tapping it.

At the expense of writing this really long post and getting no reaction to it, I want to know why you like Gaiman and how you think he compares next to his contemporaries or even classical works. If you think he's the best writer of all time, that's cool - but what I want to know is WHY. Much of my work will be centred around this question.

Again, I'd like to hear any and all of you. I'm quite eager to listen and talk, so post away!

Cheers,
Dave

There is literary criticism about Neil. Hardly any quality lit crit is available for free on the internet. You may want to try going to your library.

ps - Wikipedia is not a solid source. If you're using that for your research, I absolutely suggest learning about other resources available to you.

Hi,

I suggested Wikipedia to those who wanted an introduction to the definition of cultural studies, as it is such a broad field that I could never do it justice.

The thing is that at the moment I'm not interested in standard 'theoretical' lit crit - I'm interested in how Internet culture informs Neil's work. That's why I feel empirical data, such as this website and others, is important. This post is simply meant to bring out more reactions than I have already read here.

Thanks for replying!
Dave

Hello WD - I'd think if you wanted to know what people here think about American Gods, your best bet is to have a thorough read-and-trawl of the 'American Gods' section on these messageboards - there's tons of stuff there.

quote:

Originally posted by Wordsmith_Dave:
1) Did you like American Gods? Why or why not?

It was okay, although I think that Gaiman's best work was roughly from Sandman to the short stories in Smoke and Mirrors. As far as I'm concerned, Gaiman is better at short narratives or episodic stories than at larger, overarching plots. (Even Sandman is often episodic.)

quote:

2) If you were to put American Gods into a genre, what would it be?

Speculative fiction. Perhaps magic realism.

quote:

3) If you have read other works by Gaiman, why were you attracted to them?

How, in his best work, he doesn't just go for one genre and its conventions. His inventiveness in modernising old myths and narratives.

quote:

4) How often do you read, or how much experience with English literature do you have?

PhD in English Literature and six years of teaching experience for Eng.Lit. (BA level, mainly).

quote:

5) What is your sex and (ballpark) age?

Male, 32.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

1) Did you like American Gods? Why or why not?

I thought american gods was the single most wonderful thing I had ever read when I read it. The historical research in relation to the different mythologies, the intricate plot lines, the fact that I never knew what was coming next even though i was familiar with most of the gods. The personalities were so well developed, and the book just felt real.

2) If you were to put American Gods into a genre, what would it be?

Speculative Fiction or Modern Fantasy

3) If you have read other works by Gaiman, why were you attracted to them?

I read everything from neil i can find, because American Gods was wonderful and so far everything neil writes(even his blog) has its moments of amazingness.

4) How often do you read, or how much experience with English literature do you have?

All the books i read are in english...

5) What is your sex and (ballpark) age?

25 and male.

quote:

Originally posted by Wordsmith_Dave:
1) Did you like American Gods? Why or why not?

i thought it was ok. i thought the idea was very good but the characterisation was weak... shadow is less than an everyman, really, he's just a cipher. It didn't have the verve of the best fantasy. Nevertheless it was a capable and imaginative piece of work

quote:

2) If you were to put American Gods into a genre, what would it be?

it's fantasy.

quote:

3) If you have read other works by Gaiman, why were you attracted to them?

i've read all his stuff, beginning with the Sandman, which is still his crowning achievement. the ability to fly through genres is his strenght, and play with the eonventions of storytelling... sandman is essentially about stories, and storytelling, a very meta text... none of his work since has managed that, and has moved towards the tweer end of the spectrum.

quote:

4) How often do you read, or how much experience with English literature do you have?

i read daily, and i have a BA and MA in English literature. I wrote my dissertation on The Sandman

quote:

5) What is your sex and (ballpark) age?

male, 31

Hi Dave,

I don't see your location, but if you are anywhere within striking distance of New Orleans, the College English Association's annual conference will include a special panel on Neil Gaiman this year. It's in mid-April. Here's the announcement. That might be a good way to see what several scholars with different perspectives are saying. The panel topic is "Neil Gaiman: Comic Book Novelist," so surely somebody would be tackling American Gods. (I saw the list of papers a while ago, and I remember one of them being about Stardust, but I can't remember the others, sorry.)

And p.s. to Murphy:

If you're willing to share it, may I ask the title, year, and school of your MA thesis? I doubt I can get an interlibrary loan to Taiwan, but maybe I'll be in England or US for long enough to read it sometime...

Cheers,

Bai

1) Did you like American Gods? Why or why not?
I did. It was the first Gaiman book i read besides Good Omens. Now that i've read more of his stuff, i like some of that better, but i still really like that one.

2) If you were to put American Gods into a genre, what would it be?
oh boy, genres. Erm, idk, semi-realistic magical mythical stuff if that counts.

3) If you have read other works by Gaiman, why were you attracted to them?
I honestly don't really know. Maybe it's just that he's a good writer. I do really like his style.

4) How often do you read, or how much experience with English literature do you have?
Well i'm just a soph in high skool, so technically not much. but i'm a reading fiend, so i've read a lot of english literature. i haven't really studied it much though.

5) What is your sex and (ballpark) age?
i'm a virgin, and 15

1. Did you like American Gods? Why or why not?

Yes, I liked it. Not as much as his short stories and Neverwhere, though. Doesn't mean it wasn't good...it's all a very thin, blurry line as to how high books rank on my list. Why? Well, I like myths and I live in America...and I did approach it with a curiosity about how he perceives America.

2. If you were to put American Gods into a genre, what would it be?

Fiction. Plain. Simple. Easy to figure out where it is in a store.

3. If you have read other works by Gaiman, why were you attracted to them?

Yes. I don't know. I guess it's because he writes in a way that's similar to the way I think. Yet, his style also sounds like the way my brother jokes about things and the way a friend of mine offers his bleak cynicism about certain situations. So, in a word...it is familiar.

4. How often do you read, or how much experience with English literature do you have?

All the time. I took AP Literature in high school and the core English class they offer here in college (which wasn't much different from the high school class).

5. What is your sex and (ballpark) age?

Female. 20.

I just wanted to pop in and say 'thank you' to all of you for replying - what you've written helps a lot, and if you want to add anything more, please feel free.

I'm currently writing the essay, so if you have the strange urge to read about deconstruction, aesthetics and the cultural field (and how all of these things apply to Gaiman), feel free to drop me a line - we'll talk

Thanks again!

quote:

Originally posted by Xiao Bai:
If you're willing to share it, may I ask the title, year, and school of your MA thesis? I doubt I can get an interlibrary loan to Taiwan, but maybe I'll be in England or US for long enough to read it sometime...

ummm.
i don't think that they would keep a copy of a BA dissertation. My MA thesis was something totally different!

I'd quite like to read your essay Dave, if you can make it available somehow.

American Gods is my second-favourite thing by Gaiman (after Sandman, obviously) and although I know this isn't meant to be a debate or anything, I'd like to say the main reason I love it so much is Shadow. I've never seen better characterisation of a quiet, understated person.

Okay, I am going to risk sounding idiotic here--but I swear I am not I have a degree in English from Berkeley and am an English teacher, but I have never heard the word "cipher" used in quite the way I have seen on this board. I assume it is being used to say that Shadow was an empty character or basically his personality is simply an absence of personality....? Can someone clarify this for me?

quote:

Originally posted by Wordsmith_Dave:
1) Did you like American Gods? Why or why not?

I loved Amerian Gods. In terms of style, I loved the unusualness of the narrative, and the way in which several different threads were kept going at once, or were hinted at early on only to be fully revealed later. Also, I'm a mythology nerd, and appreciated the whole 'gods as people among us' premise. Finally, I like the Gaiman 'straight-with-funny-bits' writing style - it makes, I believe, for a greater degree of realism, because as well as being serious, life is also absurd and hilarious, and I find that the poingent moments are made more so because of their balance against the funny or ironic ones.

quote:

Originally posted by Wordsmith_Dave:
2) If you were to put American Gods into a genre, what would it be?

Speculative fiction/fantasy.

quote:

Originally posted by Wordsmith_Dave:
3) If you have read other works by Gaiman, why were you attracted to them?

The premises; the world-behind-the-world idea. I'm a sucker for it.

quote:

Originally posted by Wordsmith_Dave:
4) How often do you read, or how much experience with English literature do you have?

I learned to read when I was three and pretty much haven't stopped since. I'm a mad mythology nerd, I love Shakespeare, I've got several shelves of wmuch-thumbed classic and modern poetry and about five bookcases of fiction, fantasy and history. Also, aspiring author and Arts student.

quote:

Originally posted by Wordsmith_Dave:
5) What is your sex and (ballpark) age?

Female; age 21

willowtreeling:

cipher

NOUN: A totally insignificant person: nebbish, nobody, nonentity, nothing. Informal : pip-squeak, zero. Slang : shrimp, zilch. ...

- Roget’s II: The New Thesaurus, Third Edition. 1995.
(http://www.bartleby.com/62/15/C0251500.html)

I have a feeling that some of us (although not Murphy, above) may also be inserting some of the meaning of "enigma," playing off the concept of "cipher" in the cryptology sense.

OK?

- Cho

I don't have my lit text with me, but there's some precedent for a character who starts with little to know personality being referred to as a "cipher." They are empty, and are filled through the course of the story. A "tabula rasa," if you're less scared by Latin than I.

gotcha! Tabula rasa was the term I always heard, particularly in terms of my Pamela, Rape of the Lock, and the Autobiography of Ben Franklin. I'd just never come across cipher used quite that way before, though it makes total sense. I think the profs at my university liked to show off by using their latin terminology...lol--they were so pompous there. Also, much of my literary stimulation lately has come from 12 year olds, so....yeah.....

Now that I think harder though, I do remember this cheesey film in my credential program about a boy who know one knew called "A Cipher in the Snow."

"Tabula rasa" = blank tablet or blank slate? That's how I'm familiar with it.

1)I enjoyed American Gods immensely. I think some of the narrative felt a little overly reminiscent of other works of his (exc. Stardust). The "Coming to America" segments are where he really fleshed it out. Gaiman has a special talent to turn his witticisms into morsels of insight and vice versa. One of the problems I find with it, however, is that Gaiman refuses to give us a psychology to his supporting characters beyond what our protagonist sees and hears. The characters are still consistent and believable, but since I can't see what makes them tick, they're less people or gods and more like wax statues and automatons.

2)Speculative fiction, or neo-mythology.

3)I've read all of his texts except the Sandman appendices, and [U]Smoke and Mirrors[/U]. What always hooks me into Gaiman is his plot - as opposed to many writers, who start with a plot and build events to flesh it out, Gaiman seems to start with an event, and suffuses them with other instances that occur to him, and finally pulls a cohesive narrative filament from what he's made. Because of this approach, his stories, however unfathomable or bizarre, can still make types of sense that 70% of the more pragmatic authors in the world cannot.

4) I'm a senior in High School, with two AP English courses under my belt. So, not much formal experience, but plenty of knowledge garnered from my odd choice of recreation. I don't find much to like about classical Brit authors. I've tried Wilde (okay, Irish) and Joyce (again) and Chesterton, but a lot of the old stuff I have to force myself into. Especially "Dorian Gray". That one nearly killed me.

5) 17, Male.

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