quote:

he already runs a lot

yeah i guess they'll have to CGI it. although i think it would be cool if it was animated - like roger rabbit?

quote:

Originally posted by Thirith & His Enormous Tibia:

quote:

Originally posted by ZoneSeek:
Terry Pratchett is probably the best subversive in fantasy today, better than Neil, better than China Mieville, maybe better than Michael Moorcock. There's this utterly exquisite interplay between story cliches and realistic consequences. It's fantasy for hecklers. When a human is turned into a frog, only Pratchett would ask, where does all the extra mass go?

You have a point there, but I think it only holds for Pratchett's subversion of fantasy and fairytale clichés, and as such I find it a tad limited. There's only so much fantasy parody you can do before you're basically doing variations on variations on variations on a theme.

Pratchett's said that he started by just mocking post-Tolkien fantasy, but he's gone past that, and guys like Piers Anthony and Jack Chalker are left in the dust. I've read Pratchett's early stuff and it's limited, but I'd peg the turning point at Lords and Ladies. Neil gets critical acclaim for repudiating comicbook cliche in Black Orchid, I read it and thought, heck, this is what Pratchett does all the time.

When a story says "This isn't a story/movie/comicbook! This is for real, for keeps!" it's a tricky gambit, but impressive when it works. That's what Pratchett does, he breaks the fourth wall without betraying the story with plotless pomo crap. Over and over, from character pov or in authorial voice, we can expect things like maybe "This is the part where the hero says something stupid like 'This is between you and me, Fei! Let the girl go!'"

re-reading Making Money and I'm to the Cabinet of Curiosity bit - I love that bit, it's just so... gamain-esque. (I'm being redundant, but...) when I read that bit it gave me the same weird feeling that I had when my cousin first showed me a mobius strip and made me draw a line on it. And when I first encountered the Tardis - the whole "it's bigger on the inside" concept boggled my mind, but it also made me think about how such things might work. It made me appreciate science and math more because you could do these truly bizarre things. Although my education got squashed by eejits who tried to shove a square peg into a round hole, my love of science fiction grew from there and I discovered books! I'm fairly sure that the Madeleine L'Engle stuff was discovered around that time too.

But I really enjoyed the whole Cabinet of Curiosity concept, and it seemed a very vivid description. I didn't quite understand the "for my sins" line that the wizards tacked on - is this a British joke that I just didn't get?

uh, from memory is that when ponder describes his job? "i'm the [insert job title here], for my sins"?

it's just a saying, really, it doesn't really mean anything. it's kind of a way of saying "see what i've been lumbered with?" but not in a complaining way. um. i'm not explaining this very well, am i?

well i understood what you meant fion

yes, 'for my sins' means that the job or task is something given to you and that you must have been a very bad person to be given this job/task. it's normally said very tounge in cheek.

Yes, it seemed tongue-in-cheek, but it also seemed like I was missing something, some little in-joke that I should know, but don't.

I felt the same way about the tea reference in Night Watch, that Vimes liked his tea boiled in a builder's boot or something like that - it just struck me as Pratchett assuming that I know what he's talking about and I feel like an eejit because I don't have a clue.

Which is admittedly, entirely my problem.

Anyway - Cabinet of Curiosity = Totally ace!

boiled orange in a builders boot with yesterdays milk and 3 sugars (i think)

um, again, no real in joke (that i know of). but i guess jokes about tea will always resonate more with the english audience?

and maeve, it's not your fault you were born on the wrong continent

Heads up -

Terry Pratchett is gonna be on this program "On the Ropes" on Radio 4 this time next week, and there's a repeat too.

I dunno if the Foreigners will be able to listen, but it it'll be available to listen to on the website for seven days after the repeat.

quote:

Originally posted by fionchadd:
boiled orange in a builders boot with yesterdays milk and 3 sugars (i think)

um, again, no real in joke (that i know of). but i guess jokes about tea will always resonate more with the english audience?

and maeve, it's not your fault you were born on the wrong continent

If you brew tea (boiled? yikes!) too long - at least erm, "bog standard" tea- you will sometimes end up with this cloudy orangish-brown brew....also if you brew very very strong tea to make iced tea and throw ice in it while it's still hot (ah food service- the things we learn).
Mix that with yesterday's milk and a lot of sugar and you'll have a cuppa that won't taste very good, will cause your teeth to pucker but will make you stand up straight, pop your eyes open and keep moving even when you by rights should be out cold.

There's a nice interview with Terry Pratchett on Radio 4 here (I think it'll stay online 'til Tuesday) if anyone be's interested.
T'is charming, and touching and sad.

I heard that, Aisha. It was rather lovely.

It was quite beautiful the way he spoke of being ill and not thinking about it too much or feeling sorry for himself, just "getting on with it". The man has a wonderful attitude to life.

quote:

before you can kill the dragon, you've got to name it.

i like that.

but then, i like a lot of dragon myths and twist, like the one in gibons decline and fall, where the dragon holds the young girls under it's wing and teaches them, rather than devours them.

*bumped*

okay ripig Alex Freeman- you have two real choices.

1) Start at the beginning. The colour of magic and the light fantastic are not what they became, but are not bad reading anyway. you then work your way up to the current ones.

2) we have several story threads that each have their own drop on point and some stand alone.

1) guards guards
2) weird sisters
3) hogfather.

okay, i've got to run
i'll try and add more info later.


edit : coughcough apologies to both ripig and alex for getting them mixed up!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Smaug,

Mort can be read out of context too - there's a couple of follow-ups to it, too.

If I was going to reccomend one to start on it would be Mort. It's much more Pratchetty than the early ones, and has a good range of his themes and tone.

*nods*

mort, not hogfather, you are right - i was hurrying out when i posted¬!

i'd recommend guards guards, but then i adore all the city watch books.

and for memorable stand alones you have:

small gods (about gods and belief)
making movies (about the film industry)
the truth (about publishing).

and you've just read the first tiffany book, which is sort of a spin off on the witches books.

My first foray into Pratchettism was Monstrous Regiment, which was a very wonderful intro, even if I did have to go "who the hell is Sam Vimes?"

quote:

Originally posted by Smaug:
okay ripig - you have two real choices.

1) Start at the beginning. The colour of magic and the light fantastic are not what they became, but are not bad reading anyway. you then work your way up to the current ones.

2) we have several story threads that each have their own drop on point and some stand alone.

1) guards guards
2) weird sisters
3) hogfather.

okay, i've got to run
i'll try and add more info later.

Wrong poster Smaug, it was another person that asked about reading only 2-5 books, lol! I wouldn't dream of doing that in a million years.
Personally, I am falling in love with Pratchett and will read everything the man has written.

*blushes*

whoops! you are of course right, you were saying you were looking forward to reading the 69 books in the library!

d'oh - i am so sorry for getting you mixed up.

that is why you have to get yourself more to WE and the social threads and let us know you better so i don't do this again